Cold Open On Trust

SPEAKER_04 0:00

I think about our relationship and how there has to be a trust to be guided. But the as a string, you also have to really love what the kite does. It has to be fascinating to you. Yeah. Or else, why am I even here?

SPEAKER_00 0:17

Yeah, I can promise you. If you was out here selling perfume, wrap it up.

SPEAKER_06 0:21

Wrap it up. There's something about what's that serious. So if you didn't charge perfume, he's not trying to hear it.

Welcome To Into Love

SPEAKER_04 0:32

Um everybody, it's your girl Lish Speaks, and welcome back to another episode of my podcast, I'll Just Let Myself In. The podcast where we don't wait for an imaginary permission slip or some seat at an imaginary table, we let ourselves into our God-given doors. And if you are looking at me like, why is she cheesing? Why is she so happy today? It is because I have my favorite person in the world sitting at the table with me. This is going to be the third year that we do our episode entitled Into Love. Now we gotta apologize to y'all. We're a little late. We normally try to get this to you guys around Valentine's Day, but we went on a trip with uh some of our closest friends to Valentine's Day, and then my birthday came and we had a whole lot going on. So y'all getting it, y'all getting the episode, okay? Y'all get something up. Some people have asked me, like, y'all not gonna do an episode. We are doing the episode. And uh this episode is entitled Into Love. Please welcome back to the podcast, my co-producer, my chief investor.

SPEAKER_09 1:56

Oh man. The title's coming out.

SPEAKER_04 1:59

My love, my best friend, my husband. What do we say your real name? Say my real name. Glad Jumi James Blaine.

SPEAKER_00 2:07

The whole government. Thank you so much. I am happy to be back at the table three years in a row, the first guest to hit three years, uh three appearances. So I'll take it. I'll take the wins. But thank you so much. Uh, this is, I was gonna say it's a blessing. It is a blessing. Yeah, but also I live here.

SPEAKER_04 2:23

Yeah, also it's also in your living room. So welcome. Um, he is normally sitting over there. So when I am filming the podcast, I'll often uh look to him to make sure everything is going right.

SPEAKER_00 2:36

Um if you ever hear any any questions or disembodied voices, that that is me.

SPEAKER_04 2:41

Yes, I'll ask a question. Sometimes I'll edit it out, but sometimes I'll be like, baby, is that right? Or did I say that? Sometimes I'll leave it in. So I'm excited because this episode is going to be different than any of the other episodes, just by nature of the year we have had.

SPEAKER_00 2:58

Yes, it has been a year.

SPEAKER_04 2:59

Uh, I was listening to the last one that we did, and our lives were completely different. In fact, this time last year, so many of the things that are staples in our lives right now that are just real realities for us, yeah, did not exist. It wasn't a question, wasn't even a thought.

SPEAKER_00 3:20

Wasn't a thought. Was not a thought, was not a consideration, wasn't it was nothing.

SPEAKER_04 3:25

Yes, absolutely. So I feel like in this episode, you know, we're talking about into love, but it's love on a different level.

SPEAKER_02 3:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 3:34

Because when love is fun and easy, and and you know, we're blessed enough that no matter what life throws at us, we still are having fun.

SPEAKER_00 3:40

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 3:40

Right? But I would not categorize this year as easy.

SPEAKER_00 3:44

Yeah, that's fair. That's very fair.

SPEAKER_04 3:46

And so I um I'm excited because I feel like through the short time we've been married, God has given us some experiences this year that I think can help and encourage others. Um, but I'm excited. I'm excited. Do you want to do what I'm stepping in? Uh nah. Okay, we ain't gonna do what I'm stepping in.

SPEAKER_00 4:04

You want to do one for you or just I'm good. I'm good.

SPEAKER_04 4:06

Listen, the people know I got sneakers.

SPEAKER_00 4:08

Y'all know I got the sneakers, okay?

SPEAKER_04 4:10

Um, but yeah, I'm excited. So, so we are, as I alluded to a moment ago, we are in a new place physically.

SPEAKER_00 4:17

If you haven't noticed.

SPEAKER_04 4:18

If you haven't noticed, so if you've been watching the podcast, you've already heard me talk about this. We moved to New Jersey from Atlanta a couple months ago. So we're in a new place physically. Uh, I feel like we're in a new place relationally. Yeah. I feel like we're in a new place romantically, and uh obviously spiritually. Because with all that transition, there's no way for you not to be transformed spiritually. Um, I want to ask you, how do you feel about being a husband in this season of our lives in marriage?

SPEAKER_00 4:48

Yeah. There's so much. There's so much, like you said before, like this this past year has been very trying. Um but at the same time, like it's also been very reaffirming for me as a husband, as your husband specifically. I think one thing I always think about is, and you know this, when we were dating, when we were engaged, and very lovey dovey, and people would always say to us, like, oh, it's it's like that now, you're in the honeymoon season now, but when you know, when life gets real, when when this and that happens, like that's when it's gonna get serious. And one, we like kind of laughed at all because it's like, oh no, like yeah, we're like this is just how we are. Yeah, and the funny thing is, I feel like this past year reaffirmed that for me.

SPEAKER_04 5:34

For me too.

SPEAKER_00 5:34

Where it's just like, yeah, we did get through the difficult stuff, and we're still cheesing. It's really how we are. We're still happy, we're still not arguing, we're not fighting. It's just like we locked in. Yeah, we we very quickly realized like it is us against the world, and we moved accordingly. Yeah, and it's just like I said, it's very reaffirming to know, like, yeah, like no, something, some storm is gonna take this season from us. Like, this is just who we are, this is what our relationship is.

SPEAKER_04 6:01

Yeah, absolutely. I feel the same way. I think that um you've been an incredible husband and friend and lover and all the things through this season of change. Um, you know, just to spell out the story, I feel like I've done this already, but in the interest that there are new people watching, hey y'all, I I hope there are new people watching. We last year in March, April found out that there were whispers that my husband uh might be having to move back to New York to go into office for his work.

SPEAKER_08 6:31

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 6:31

Um, my husband loves his work, he's excellent at it. Um, every time I turn around, there's some award or recognition, or they're sending him somewhere to do something special. And so for me, it was either you find a better job or we go to New York.

SPEAKER_02 6:47

Quit your job was never that never even came up.

SPEAKER_04 6:51

You know what I mean? One, he loves what he does, he's excellent at it. Well, that was never pressure. Absolutely. Um, he works really hard to be where he is. And I like a certain lifestyle. You can't want a certain lifestyle, tell a man of God to quit his job. That that don't make no sense. Okay. So I said, well, either we're gonna find something else or, you know, we're gonna be moving. And long story short, he looked. That was not God's plan for us to stay in Georgia and we had to move back. And as he shared just now, I feel like we really just looked in each other's eyes and said, it's us. Yeah, we are each other's family. Yeah, you know, and I had to leave my family, which was very difficult in Atlanta. Uh, but he was coming to his family in New York, and that brought a sense of comfort to me as well because he had already left his family to marry me, right? He left New York, yeah, came to Atlanta, no license.

SPEAKER_00 7:43

I was rough, I was living rough.

SPEAKER_04 7:44

Learned how to drive, but you learn how to drive in a couple weeks. Yeah. Learn how to drive.

SPEAKER_00 7:48

From nothing. I didn't have a permit. I just stepped into it.

SPEAKER_04 7:51

Yes, every New York City. I mean, catching the train and the Ubers and the taxis, got his license, proposed to me within like two months of being there, which I didn't know he already had the ring before he even left New York, but I didn't know that, obviously. Really started our life together. And so you had already sacrificed so much for me. New church, new friends, away from your family for the first time. Like, so it I would have been crazy to make a big deal. And it's so funny because I was talking, you know, when I got the news and I was like, oh gosh, I don't want to move to New Jersey. I mean, New York, New Jersey. I didn't want to move nothing with a new. I want to Atlanta or surrounding areas. And I remember talking to one of my friends about it. She was like, girl, are you dumb? He moved for you.

SPEAKER_00 8:32

Like, you think you're not supposed to, you know what I mean?

SPEAKER_04 8:34

I was like, I know, I know.

SPEAKER_00 8:35

It is so funny because we got that advice when we were dating. Yes, I did. I think it was Brigitte Mar. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 8:42

Shout out to Brigitte and Mar.

SPEAKER_00 8:43

And I think I think she said, you know, someone is this is before we had even decided who was moving. Who was moving? And she was like, whoever makes the decision, the other person is going to be so grateful.

SPEAKER_09 8:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 8:54

That when the tables are reversed, it's not even gonna be a question. And that feels like prophetic at this point.

SPEAKER_04 8:59

That's exactly what happened. That's exactly what happened. I think that that the move brought us closer.

SPEAKER_02 9:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 9:05

I honestly feel like I'm a better wife here than I was in Atlanta.

SPEAKER_02 9:10

I feel like I'm- I'm a great wife. Thank you. Thank you.

SPEAKER_04 9:13

I am a great wife, but I feel like I'm a better wife here. I feel like I'm more attentive to your needs. Yeah and just more, I don't know. Just I just feel like I'm a better wife here. Um, and that that is not something I expected. I was worried that we would feel that we would get distant because our whole marriage, you've been homeworking from home.

SPEAKER_00 9:31

I was home and you worked, but you worked five minutes away. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 9:34

So I worked at my church, which was six minutes away. I was in the ministry full time, so I took appointments based on my schedule, how I wanted to schedule my day. And because we were newlyweds, people were very understanding of me wanting to be home for dinner and you know, that kind of thing. So, you know, I was very much like, what are we gonna do? You know, but one thing about my husband is that he is really a man of his word, a man of integrity. You know, he looked me in my eyes and said, I can promise you that your lifestyle is not gonna change. You know, that the way we live, the type of place we live is not gonna change. Because that's what I was worried about. I didn't want to come back to the roaches and the rats in the alternate side of the street parking. And I, I, you know.

SPEAKER_00 10:13

You knew I wasn't gonna do that. I did know that.

SPEAKER_04 10:15

The way I rolled up into Atlanta, I was like, I did know that, but I just was like, um, but he made me some assurances and promises that really made me feel even more comfortable. And just to be clear, I would come here with you and live with roaches and rats if I had to. He's the one, he's he's more bougie than me. Trust me, okay?

SPEAKER_06 10:36

Um, what are we living like? Yeah, why do we never live like that no more? Well, you never live like that.

SPEAKER_00 10:43

Don't give up my business.

SPEAKER_04 10:45

He grew up nicely. Um, but yeah, but you know, it it really made me feel very safe. And I just trust you so much that literally you can say we're moving to Timbuktu. And I'm like, okay, let's go. And I believe that. I'll make some friends over in Timbuktu. I, you know, I don't know nobody over there, but I figure.

SPEAKER_00 11:03

I don't know if I fully believe that. Not that I don't think you would have moved me, but I I think in the before I would have been like, man, like I don't know where my career could take me. You always knew that I was like always, I always had the sense of unease working remote at a company that was not itself a remote company. I'm like, I don't know where the future can take us. And there was a part of me that was afraid, like, I I don't know where we're gonna go, and I don't know how she would deal with this. And I think going through this experience, I'm like, I could ask her to move to Iceland. Yeah, and she would be like, Well, what's the date? How much can I bring?

SPEAKER_04 11:38

I said, You better live me a fur, we move in Iceland.

Learning To Lead A Home

SPEAKER_00 11:41

That's very empowering as a husband. Like it it it it brings me a true sense of peace over my household, over my family. Like, yeah, like we can really tackle anything.

SPEAKER_04 11:51

Yeah, that reminds me of a question that I have way in the back, but I'm gonna go to it now. I feel like you take the role of setting the tone for our household like really seriously. I feel like you take the role of leading your household. You say that a lot, you say our family, even though it's just the two of us. You you have that about you. Where did you get that from? Why why do you think you're like that?

SPEAKER_00 12:11

Oh, that's a good question. You know, I when I get questions like this, I I never quite know where to go because we didn't have growing up, we didn't have this like this is how you lead a family, this is how you like we didn't have those talks. Like, I I feel like there was so much I got through osmosis being around, and I I'm a I was a very observant kid in terms of consequences.

SPEAKER_10 12:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 12:35

I'm like, oh, this person did this, you're still that way, and that's how their life ended up that way. These people did that, and they gotta figure it out. I didn't do it like that. So I think I think being around so much of that, I credit my parents for, especially my dad. Well for me, I think my work ethic comes from my dad.

SPEAKER_10 12:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 12:54

Um, both positive and negative, like both in terms of like being a very hardworking man, but also being a hardworking man at something he didn't want to work at. And it's like, oh, it's not enough to be hardworking because you can end up very unhappy, yeah working hard at something that you don't feel that doesn't fulfill you.

SPEAKER_10 13:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 13:13

So combining that with what it meant to like step up as a man, my dad was very much like, even with all of his baggage, like he stepped up very in a very big way. Like, oh, that's where my idea of manhood comes from. Like a man steps up, a man establishes sort of a a ground, a ground rule of the household. Um seeing my friends' parents, um, seeing my cousin's parents, like I'm blessed to have grown up in a space where a lot of people had a mom and dad. Like that was that was a common thing for for the people that I was around in terms of cousins and and family friends. So having so much of those examples of like I could pick from this family, I could pick from that family, I can pick from this father, and sort of craft my own idea of what a mandating a house would look like.

SPEAKER_04 14:00

Yeah, I love that. I love that. Yeah, I love that you got a daddy, that you had a daddy. It's very important, you know. It's so funny because when I was in my 20s, I had made a list of things that, you know, I wanted in a man and in a husband, and I, you know, I had gone through whatever I was going through, and I was like, ah, I'm never dating this type of man again and that type of man again and all this stuff. Um, and two of the things that really, really stand out to me when I think about you is I said, no more artists. I didn't want anyone who even like you, I don't even want you to like art, nothing. Because I have been with so many creative men. I know. I have been with so many creative men, and I was attracted to that, but the character, and again, this is not for all creatives, but a lot of us, and I can point to myself, we take a long time to grow in the character that it takes to sustain hard work. And so I had realized that that was an issue for a lot of the artists that I, you know, dealt with. And then, and this is no shade, but a lot of daddyless sons, I was like, I'm done with that. Because I could see, I could just see the difference when a man had a father, not a perfect father, but a father who was present and who he liked and who he felt loved by. I saw the difference in the men that I dated or was talking to, and I was like, yo, I definitely want that. And and amongst all the things on that list, which you are about 95% of that list, I think the only thing you don't have is I said I wanted a man who played sports because I'm gonna tell you, I'm gonna tell you why I wanted that. It wasn't about athleticism. It was I wanted a man who somebody could yell in his face and he could take it. I wanted a man who could take correction. Because I felt like a lot of times when God's in play, you know me.

SPEAKER_07 15:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 15:53

A lot of times when God, I was very observant in my late 20s, and I'm like, you've never had another man yell in your face and tell you to sit down. And it shows.

SPEAKER_02 16:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 16:02

And it shows. Um, so you don't have to have sports to have that. You can have a daddy, you know. But I was like, if he ain't got the daddy, he gotta at least have had a coach. Yeah, somebody. And so I think you just, you know, talking about how in your community, you know, you had cousins and family friends and church friends who had mothers and fathers in the home, it kind of gave you something to look forward to, look to and look forward to. And I really do see that in the way that you lead our family. Like it's very, very evident that you, you know, believe in structure. Um, I happen to be a very, I wouldn't call myself a trad wife, um, but I happen to have very traditional principles about what a wife looks like to me. To me. And what a husband looks like to me. And so I was grateful when we started getting to know each other. Cause I'm like, oh, he agrees. We we see this the same way. And that's important, right? Because the truth of the matter is your marriage gotta work for you.

SPEAKER_02 17:00

Yeah.

Uncertainty And Surrender To God

SPEAKER_04 17:01

If you okay with doing certain things a certain way, he's okay, that's great. Yeah, you know, you just gotta be with somebody who sees it the way you see it. And we are fortunate enough to be, you know, married to each other, yeah, and knowing that we see things the same way. Um, let me go back to the beginning because that was at the end of my notes. Um, what do you think is hard about being married or being a husband in this season?

SPEAKER_00 17:25

Um, in this season specifically, yeah. The uncertainty is hard for me. You know, I'm uh I'll have a plan.

SPEAKER_04 17:34

What do you feel uncertain about?

SPEAKER_00 17:36

Just what our life is gonna look like in the next year, in the next two years. Like we we left this time last year. We had a plan. Yes. We had money in the bank, we had houses saved on Zillow, we had we had it all figured out. We knew the day our lease was ending, we knew, we knew down to when we wanted to start having chill, like we knew ever we thought we knew everything. Fuck that about how last year and this year would go.

SPEAKER_07 18:06

Fuck that.

SPEAKER_00 18:07

And it it's just been flipped upside down. Yeah. Like obviously, the the preparation is still good. There's still things about that that allowed us to come into this season more prepared. Yeah, way more prepared than most people would, and and sort of just like set a really good ground level for us. But there is still an uncertainty on you know where things will end up. And it's a short-term uncertainty, which is which is strange. It's usually like, oh, I don't know what the long term is gonna look like. I feel pretty clear about the long term. I can I feel pretty clear about where we're gonna be in five, ten years, but in the next three years, things can go in so many different directions that bring us to the five-year plan. And that that's that's a weird space for me to be in because I like to I like to keep things orderly. Yeah, I like to be moving towards something in in my line of sight, not not five, ten years. I love a one-year plan. I love a just like, oh, I can see that. Like we're gonna get there and it'll be incremental. Yeah, it's just it's just hard right now.

SPEAKER_04 19:05

Yeah. That's so that is not what I was expecting you to say. I think, well, one, thank you for sharing um and being vulnerable in that way. Because I know as a man, that can be difficult to not feel like you know exactly where you're going. The way that you lead us, I would never think that. So it's like you know, it's so funny. When I say the house is not clean, he looks at me like I'm crazy. He's like, babe, the house is fine. What are you talking about? So when you that's how I feel right now. When you're like, I just don't know what's gonna happen in the year. I'm like, you literally just told me. Well, like you're playing with that chair. But I guess I guess I could also see for you the intricacies, right? Yeah. Because it's the same thing I mean with the house. You can look at the house, and to the naked eye, the house looks clean. I'm looking at the fact that the glass on our console on our couch needs to be sprayed on and wiped off. We need to wipe around the sinks. Is the tub clean? Is under the tub, you know, I the intricacies.

SPEAKER_00 19:58

There are so many little things that that add up to it and the complexity builds, and it's just like it's they're all individually things that can be tackled. When you look at the the whole, it's just like I don't even know what to do with this.

SPEAKER_04 20:11

Okay. What what do you think I could do to help with that? Is there anything I can do as a wife that would help you feel more confident about that?

SPEAKER_00 20:23

I don't know. I'll be honest, I don't know. I think I think this is a a me and God thing, if I'm being like that's what my that's what my spirit is telling me right now. Like this has also been a year of surrender for me. And I've if there is one spiritual weakness that I have had for my entire you know, spiritual life, it has been a struggle with surrender. And I think this is God really tugging on that for me, saying, like, you just need to give it to me, you need to let me lead. You need to let you need to trust that I know what is best for you and for your family. And he's he's shown me that so many times, or it's it's not even like I don't even know if I can do this. Like, it's like no, I've been here before, and you've showed up for me before, like I just need to trust that he can keep showing up and he can establish his because ultimately it's his plans that get established. Right. It's never my plan. If I'm being if I'm being totally honest, it's never my plan that gets established. And I just need to get I just need to get back in a spiritual space where I'm just like you're gonna handle this a little bit, you know.

SPEAKER_04 21:31

How do you feel like you're doing spiritually?

SPEAKER_00 21:35

Good question. I'm not my best right now. Yeah, I'm really not my best. Um I think this transition, it was difficult. It is, it continues to be difficult for me because it it feels very much like a limbo space. It feels just like what are we doing? What like what's next? Like I'm it's weird because I'm a naturally patient person. Yes. I'm usually very good with being in a limbo space. And this is, I think, one of the first times of my life where it's just like, this is uncomfortable. Like, this is very, this is very going through the motions. This is very, and like things are getting better. Like we're we're uh at a place now where we're we feel like we're finding a church family again. Um and I think that was a big part of me taking a spiritual hit. Like I just starting to feel like I had found my people at our old church. And then this, this, you know, this rock hits. Um, but I feel like thank God, like we're getting to a place where God willing, we can establish that quickly with some new folks that we've been introduced to. But I I think, and I think there's also this thing where it's just like, and I'm just gonna be real, like, I think everyone who's been a Christian for a long time, like a devoted Christian, you just hit this season of just like what am I doing?

SPEAKER_04 22:54

What am I doing? That's like I'm doing me.

SPEAKER_00 22:59

Yeah, it's just, yeah, it's just, it's I don't know how, I don't know how to like articulate it.

SPEAKER_04 23:04

It's like what I talked about with Mo, I think. Like you just kind of hit a season where you you might be freestyling a little bit. You don't even know how you got there. You're not in no big crazy sense. You're just not necessarily going to God with the sincerity and depth and like desire that you need to like that long and God show me the way. It's kind of like, Lord, help me get this train, help me sparking spot. I love you. Please help my family be okay. You know, it's not the same. And I, yeah, we all get there.

SPEAKER_00 23:31

Yeah, yeah. It's funny because something that I've recently discovered that's helping me push through that is I'm trying to do a better job of bringing God into the things that naturally draw my attention. And there's this, like I have this big like thing around like productivity culture and all that.

SPEAKER_07 23:50

And there's this yes, I know.

SPEAKER_00 23:52

But there's this thing that I found that's called biblical productivity, where it's just like just this guy on YouTube. Um, and he and he kind of goes through that from a biblical lens, and it I find that it connects me. I showed you a video. Yeah, very, very moody. Very he's the guy you beat on the moody, and you like moody.

SPEAKER_06 24:08

Yeah, I like moody. Real moody.

SPEAKER_00 24:10

But um, but it it it it helps me establish sort of this biblical grounding on this thing that has so much space in my brain. And I think that is sort of like a clue of what I need to push through this season of just like bring God into the things that you are not normally bringing God in on. Yeah, you know, I think for me that's always just been like work, like, oh, like I'll just be a good Christian at work, but like so much more than that now. Like just producing this podcast, like you know, the things that I do in my leisure, like yeah, wanting to start a business, doing our business and solo business, like bringing God into all of those things.

SPEAKER_04 24:45

You got a couple business solo, his friend, helping that friend.

SPEAKER_00 24:50

You know, so I think I think that's that's that's a new thing that's very new, but I feel like that's gonna be an unlock for me to really reestablish uh that sincerity that you're talking about.

SPEAKER_04 25:00

Yeah, I can see that. And I think too, I think, you know, one of the things that I think we have going for us the most in our marriage is that both of us ain't gonna be weak. Both of us are not gonna be, you know what I mean? Like I feel like I'm in a season where, and obviously it's easier, right? Because you go to work for several hours a week, right? I work on our podcast, work on my content, but I'm an entrepreneur and a stay-at-home wife. So I can have a two-hour quiet time and tell you all about this and the Greek and what I'm learning and what I'm reading. And you're like, baby.

SPEAKER_00 25:32

He was playing some some pronunciation thing. I'm like, what was the word?

SPEAKER_06 25:37

I want to say that from the Greek word.

SPEAKER_00 25:41

She prepares her for a podcast. She's like, oh, this is a light Bible study. I'm like, you you do a meditation. This is not a light study.

SPEAKER_04 25:49

I am I am in the I'm in that season, I'm in that mode. Um, and we spent the whole of 2025 studying out the Holy Spirit together and with our church back in in Georgia. And boy, did we need it.

SPEAKER_07 26:03

Yes.

Rebuilding Faith After Transition

SPEAKER_04 26:04

Because with all the changes that were to come, personal, professional, relational um changes, I think we really needed a deeper understanding of the Holy Spirit.

SPEAKER_00 26:15

Yeah, we didn't realize it like that's God's. That's God, that's how God works.

SPEAKER_04 26:19

Um, but I also think because of that, because of how deep we were in study, you jumping back into commuting. Because I'm gonna tell you something. Commuting is no joke. I've gone to the city with him twice. And both times I've said, I'm never doing, I'm driving. I drive to the city, I don't care. I drive, I get parking, that that path train and this and that, and I still have not been on the actual MTA train since we've been here.

SPEAKER_00 26:43

I've been spoiled because the path is not that bad. But the one of the two times I've touched the MTA, I'm like, ooh.

SPEAKER_04 26:48

Yeah, but the path is not that bad, but the path is bad, the path is bad for me. Okay, get me my car. Um, and so I be driving to the city when I go, but it's a lot, it takes a lot out of you. You know what I mean? And so I think when you're going from that deep study, like you said, we were in a church family, so you're in Bible studies with other people, you know, we're going to church service on Sundays, midweek services, different things like that, to come here, go into work, be visiting churches that we don't necessarily feel enough of that.

SPEAKER_00 27:17

Yeah. Um, you know, and so I think But was also Holy Spirit led. Yes. The like the the visiting and really making sure that we found something that really called to our spirit. Yeah. And I think our default space would have been to just land at one of these churches. Absolutely. And not even this opportunity to not even pray about it, not even think about it.

SPEAKER_04 27:40

It's oh, we're just gonna go here because this is where we go.

SPEAKER_00 27:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 27:43

And uh, and you led us in that as well. So I'm saying that to say, I think you're doing great spiritually. You said you're not your best. That's fine. That's between you and your Jesus. I'm not gonna get in the way of that. But I do think some of the fall off that you might feel is because you were so deep into it in 2025 and life has just changed a bit. Yeah. Um, and that doesn't mean that you are not where you need to be spiritually. There's a there's a saying that I said one time, it was after my grandmother passed away. I'll never forget this. I was talking to, I want to say I was talking to my friend Keisha. And um, I was saying to her, I'm just not where I need to be spiritually. And she said, Where do you need to be? You've never been here before. You've never been. Keisha Dad, man. Keisha. Keisha, you've never been mourning your grandmother, you know, at the time I was in college, you know. She's like, you've never been here before. How do you know where you need to be? And I think from our discipleship culture, we have this idea of like, I'm just not where I need to be spiritually. I could be better spiritually. And maybe that's true. I I I can't, you know what I mean? But I live with you and we talk every day, and I feel good, yeah. I feel like you're doing all right.

SPEAKER_00 28:48

Yeah, no, that that's that's very that's very true and very real. I think I think there is a lot of sort of like self-guilt, self-humiliation, just that that desire to want to be doing more.

SPEAKER_04 29:01

But we were raised spiritually to never feel good enough, like ever. Yeah, no matter what. Unless you go on the cross and drop some blood, you don't deserve to be.

SPEAKER_00 29:09

And some of that is still with me. Some of that is still with me.

SPEAKER_04 29:11

Yeah, I rebuke that in the name of Jesus. Um, that's why I'm in here studying the Greek. So I don't be trapped up in these. Because I need to know for myself, because I don't know what people would tell me. Some of it. Um listen, listen, listen. The Lord does not want us to walk around feeling guilty and condemned. That is not from the Holy Spirit, it's not from Jesus. You know what I mean? Now, if you're in real sin, he wants you to repent and not ruminate. Go back and watch the last couple episodes. But if you are just living life, you know what I mean, and there's only so much that you could do. I just, I don't know. I want, I think, as like you said, as we settle into this new church family, if this is where the Holy Spirit allows us to stay, I think very quickly you will feel kind of back to your old self. It's like when you feel distant from your friends and you're like, man, I don't know. And then you hang out with them and it's like, oh, everything is fine.

SPEAKER_07 30:03

We good, we good.

Till Death Do Us Part

SPEAKER_04 30:05

So I think that um, I think that's that. But yeah, I think for me spiritually right now, again, I feel called higher. I feel very convicted about the way that I show up for you and the way that I show up around family, and the way that I show up as a media personality. It's very important to me that I'm spirit-led. And in times when I have gotten away from that, and you know those times, it's just never went well. And so I'm like, let's just not even play a girl. Get in that Bible, do what you gotta do so that you can feel the Holy Spirit and feel God's presence in your day-to-day life. And to be honest, I think just coming here, knowing that I was gonna be away from my family, knowing that I was gonna have to deal with some changes, you know, because even though, listen, I'm very grateful, I'm very grateful for the position that you have put me in, man of God. I'm very grateful. Um, I'm still an ambitious woman and I have my own dreams, goals, and desires. I have my own financial goals that I want to meet. I have my own things I want to do. So there were a lot of feelings that came with that, came with the lot of feelings that came with me leaving my job and leaving my career as an associate minister. Like, am I ever gonna find a position like that again? I had a lot of feelings about it. So I really knew like, if I don't get in my Bible, I'm gonna be walking around here not being who I need to be for my husband. And so I think it has really pushed me to be in my word. I think one of the hardest things, and I and I don't even, I'm hesitant to even talk about this because I just feel like I'm gonna break down. But um, you know, we witnessed a couple that we loved, a couple that mentored us, a couple that did our premarital counseling. Um we watched them live out the vow till death do us part.

SPEAKER_07 31:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 31:53

And when our friends, uh Kim and Ron, were going through the last stages of Kim's cancer, I think we just as a couple didn't know how to really deal with that. And for me, it it really gave real color and meaning to Till Death Do Us Part as a vow.

SPEAKER_02 32:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 32:19

I know what it taught me, and we've never talked about this, but I'm wondering what did watching Ron lose Kim teach you? Sorry, I can't even talk. What did watching Ron lose Kim teach you about being a husband and about marriage?

SPEAKER_00 32:42

This is hard. This is hard. That situation was hard. It always it it brings up memories of the grief of my parents. It's so hard just watching someone lose their life partner. Like it is it is it it is an unbearable scene to watch. And unfortunately, it's a scene that almost always plays in slow motion. Watching Ron, I think that was one that that that was one of those moments of like osmosis learning where I'm like, I'm going to take this, I'm gonna treasure this for the rest of my life, and unfortunately we probably have to emulate this one day. Of just being an upstanding person who was fully 110% focused on his wife's comfort, on what she needed, on what would make her feel good about those final days, never giving up. Um I'm sorry, um, talking to him through the weeks when they didn't know what was going on, and just this this faith and belief, like, oh, it's just it's gonna be this other thing. It's gonna be like just always having the positive attitude and being like, We're gonna beat this, we're gonna we're gonna figure it out, or this it's gonna be fine. And even when things took their absolute worst turn, just the the strength of his character was is. Um I can't I I don't even want to speak in the past tense because this is who he is to his core. It is there's so much to admire, so much to imitate.

SPEAKER_04 34:20

Yeah, yeah. I think for me, I learned that the type of wife you are to your husband is what will allow him to lead your family even in your absence. I look at the way that Ron handled Kim's passing, and I always think about him when we walked up to the casket. How he was standing there greeting everybody, talking to everybody, and then when we walked up, he said, Oh, I thought I was I thought I was gonna make it through the day. I'm like, how? It's a million people weren't behind us. Um, and we just the three of us held each other and we cried, you know, a little. And um a couple minutes later I looked over and he was with his four children and their spouses and their children, and he was being grandpa dad. And he got up and spoke at the funeral and played a voicemail from her. I thought she loved him so well that even in death she is giving him strength. And because I know Kim, I know that to be true. That's this is not just something I'm thinking, you know. I sat on their couch every Wednesday for the better part of two years. I lived with them for two months before we got married, and I saw them be best friends. And I've already prayed with God about me never leaving you on earth because I just feel like it's unfair for you to lose two parents and a wife. That's a lie on anybody.

unknown 35:58

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 35:59

So I'm like, it's going to kill me, but I would rather grieve him than him have to grieve me. Best case scenario, we go together. Um, I'm not talking about it wild. Um, unless we have kids, then I'll stay for the kids. Um, but looking at her, I thought to myself, man, I want to love a man that deeply. I want to love him that way. Um, it taught me to be best friends in real life, not just at church, not just in our case for the cameras or for Instagram or whatever. You know, they were leaders in our church. And, you know, you go hang out with some leaders and you're like, oh, y'all actually bicker all the time. Y'all don't like each other. You know, she could not speak a negative word about that man.

SPEAKER_07 36:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 36:44

Even when she was sharing about some of the things he may need to grow in, it was set with so much love and, you know, so much honor. She honored her husband. And in death and in life, he honored her. And it got real. Because you know, you say things like, oh, one of us is gonna leave each other one day. But I'm like, no, that man really had to wake up in the same bed without his wife. And it just made me want to cherish every single second. And uh I spoke to him right before we went to Milan. You already there. I was about to meet you like the next day. I think I spoke to him the day before I left. And he was just kind of giving me a rundown of all the things that we have to do. Make sure you go here, make sure you go there, you know. And the last time he was there, he was with Kim. And I just thought to myself, man, what a life they had. Yeah, you know, what a life they had for themselves, what a life they have for their children and their grandchildren. We've learned so many things in our marriage from them. They taught us to never do anything that you need more than one income to maintain. We live by that.

SPEAKER_08 37:49

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 37:50

Um, they taught us, you know, things like for big events like their children's graduations, like they did experiences instead of big gifts. Um, that's something that we've talked about, wanting to offer our kids. They talked to us about some of the mistakes they made early on in their marriage and helped us to avoid that, especially because you and Ron have a very similar work ethic. Um, I wouldn't necessarily, I'm not gonna call Ron a workaholic, but you.

SPEAKER_00 38:15

I've heard some things about Ron. He might be a workaholic.

SPEAKER_04 38:18

Yeah, but you know, I'm not gonna say that about him. I'm not gonna say that about him. I've I've heard, you know, but you uh I can say that with my chest. But he gave, you know, you some warnings and us some warnings. And um, I've always said this about Kim, but she taught me how to be a wife to an important man. I will never forget these words, and I will say them to every woman who asked me for marriage advice if her husband is ambitious and a hard worker. And the way she said it was I can't say it any better. She said, Listen, everyone is important, but some people are important to a lot of people. And she said, It takes a special kind of woman to have a husband who is important to a lot of people. Some husbands are just important to their wife, and maybe their mama, maybe. Some husbands are important at work, they sit on boards, they lead community. And she said, I can tell you right now that Jimmy is going to be that kind of husband. We were dating. We were, you hadn't even moved to Atlanta yet. And I was like, I want to marry this man. And she said, It takes a certain kind of woman to be married to an important man, a man who has to travel for work, a man who has to make big decisions, a man who may come home and still have to work some. And she taught me little jewels and gems of what it would take. She also taught me things not to do, not to settle for, you know, not to just say, okay, I'm okay with that. You know, she taught me how to advocate for myself if I didn't feel not that I needed much help in that area, but you know, if I didn't feel good about something, not in our marriage, in other areas of my spirituality, she taught me how to advocate for myself as well, especially being a woman minister, you know, things like that. But I just honor her so much in our marriage being what it is, because if it weren't for Kim and Ron, and in my case, very specifically Kim, I know that that lovey dovey, jovial, jokey thing that you said earlier about how even through the storms we have that. A lot of that is her. She taught me how to do that.

SPEAKER_08 40:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 40:21

And um, so Kim, I love you. I honor you. Um, Ron, I love you, I honor you. And um I'm just grateful that we had time with her this side of heaven, for sure. Okay. We got through that better than I thought we would. Um, we got through that better than I thought we would. Okay. So we will be at three years in August. So we're about 2.5 years in, about that. Um, is there anything that surprises you about marriage now that we're this this much time in?

What Surprises Us About Marriage

SPEAKER_00 40:55

Um what surprises me about marriage is it's it's kind of related to what I spoke to earlier, where we're able to withstand storms. And I think I think before these few years, I didn't realize just how much intentionality, how much partnership. Yeah, and and like it sounds silly in hindsight, but like some of these things you you they're told to you as if they're inevitable. You will have to have this big blow-up fight, you will have to deal with this type of person, you will have to, you know, sacrifice in these areas. And it's not that these things are not in orbit around us, but I think we do such a good job of keeping them at bay at making sure that we are focused on the real thing, on the right thing, on what makes us work. And the part about that that surprises me is it's like this is gonna sound I'm gonna risk sound arrogant, but it's like it's not hard. Yeah, like you know, it's not, it's marriage is not that hard. It is all about intention, it's all about honesty, it's all about partnership. And like if you can get these things right, you'll be shocked at how much you can overcome. Yeah, you know, how much you can not just like overcome in a sense of like this bad thing happened, but like going after the good things. Like that's overcoming as well. And that is the positive side of a good marriage, which is very attainable.

SPEAKER_04 42:33

Yeah, absolutely, absolutely. I think what surprises me the most about marriage being two and a half years in is how compatible you need to be in order to really have a happy marriage. I think that people do not give compatibility enough enough attention. They think, well, I like them, they like me, we like the same things, and that's so funny. I remember one time telling a friend of mine about me and this guy, and um I was like, but we just had so much chemistry. And she said, sometimes chemistry labs blow up, baby.

SPEAKER_02 43:07

And I was like, and it's true.

SPEAKER_04 43:11

Like, and we had tons of chemistry, but the compatibility, like, we are compatible. Sometimes it just trips me out how much we fit. Like things that you absolutely hate doing, I love doing. Things that I absolutely hate doing, you love doing.

SPEAKER_00 43:29

I always thought like the opposite track thing was like overblown. No. No, it's not real. It is real. Yes, find someone who compliments you.

SPEAKER_04 43:38

Yes, yes. Again, they can't be so opposite you that y'all have nothing in common, but complimentary is really important. And I feel like for us, I'm gonna challenge you on that.

SPEAKER_00 43:48

I I think you can be truly opposites, but you both have to be willing to step into the other person's world.

SPEAKER_05 43:56

Correct. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 43:57

I think that is, I think that's so important. Yeah, I think we talked about that. Yeah, but it's like that is so much more important, you know, really being willing to just dive in, yeah, not judge, like really take a real interest in what the other person is interested in. Yeah, like and you don't like there is no expectation to be a super fan or to change your whole, but like just to show genuine interest, it goes so far.

SPEAKER_04 44:21

Yeah, absolutely. Like, I'm never gonna know an anime the way you know anime, and you'll probably never know hip hop like I know hip-hop. But we know enough and we're learning, and we will continue to learn more, and we just don't judge each other. We sit in each other's worlds. Well, hip hop is actually not a good example because you you know a lot of hip hop. I don't know what's a good example from fashion.

SPEAKER_00 44:40

Fashion. Oh wow. I never thought, I never thought I would know so much about luxury fashion that I would be interested in. Like, yeah, like we there's this podcast that we pull up whenever we have a long Acquired. Shout out to Acquired, the Acquired podcast, and one of the first ones that we listened to together was I think on Hermes? Either Hermes or LVMH.

SPEAKER_04 45:02

Yeah, I think it was LVMH, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 45:04

But I think I put you on.

SPEAKER_04 45:06

You put me on to that podcast, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 45:08

And I'm like, but part of that was because you put me on to the idea of luxury fashion, and I'm just like, oh, like this, there is a whole universe around here, and like being able to, like, I never would have sought that out. Like, that's so much of you, yeah, sort of putting your mark on me. Yeah, that's true.

SPEAKER_04 45:26

And I'm and we're nerds for what we're nerds for. Like, I sit and watch people talk about who is going to be the next creative director of what fashion house and this and that. I want to know what people even think is gonna happen in 2027. I love trends, I love knowing about trends before trends. I have an intuitiveness about certain things in fashion. I really care um about the things that I buy. I'll never like just trying to get it to show it off. In fact, I don't really care if y'all see certain things ever. Um, but I care. And he's the same way about the things he's he cares about. And I just think being interested and as you said, fascinated when we were dating about each other's worlds really does help. And I also think as a wife, I don't know about, I can't speak for a man, but as a wife, you have to be 10 toes down and 100% okay with your man doing whatever it takes for him to feel like a man. I think a lot of times as women, we can get in the way of what that man feels like it would take to be a man because we feel like we don't need it. We feel like, well, I don't need all of that, and I don't have all of that. Yeah, but what would make him feel like the man in the relationship? Yeah, what would make him, you know, I talk all the time about listening to you. You know what I mean? It's not because I'm not smart. For Christ's sakes, I was single till I was 35. I did a whole lot of stuff on my own, traveled to other countries, had business, did my own thing, right? But when I talk to you about something, if you have a strong opinion, I'm gonna listen to it because that communicates to you that I respect you. And that is how I feel about you. I do respect you. I wouldn't have married you if I didn't. And so it's so important that you, that we as women, you know, because even compatibility can't, compatibility can't combat disrespect. You can be as combatible as you want. If you don't respect that man, the relationship is not gonna work. You know, and I think for women, compatibility cannot, you know, combat love, lovelessness, lack of emotion, lack of affection, even if it's just certain, like there are just certain primitives around being in a relationship that you can't, you just can't leave out, you can't overcome.

SPEAKER_00 47:38

And I think you're you're touching on those big time.

SPEAKER_04 47:40

Yeah, yeah. And we have that. And I think for me, um, I'm just so grateful because I feel like I get to be me as a wife. I don't have to do anything extra or be extra. And yes, there are character things I have to work on. You know, I have to work on listening more than I talk sometimes. I have to work on, not, you know, stating my opinion like it's a fact sometimes, you know how much I feel like I've gotten a lot better.

SPEAKER_07 48:05

Yeah, so much better.

unknown 48:07

I've gotten a lot better.

SPEAKER_04 48:09

Um, I have to work on being patient when I feel like things should move at a certain pace and you have a plan and you're like, no, this is how we're gonna do it. And I'm like, why? And then I then I literally asked myself, okay, so if you want to do everything, you you must not want a husband. Because you had an opportunity to do everything. It was cold when you were single. Hello? So if you want to do everything, go be single. If you want to take care of everything, and you know, I I I was um sharing this with somebody recently where we lost uh we lost power in our apartment for longer than we should have with this last snowstorm. And um, it was a crazy thing, like it was only our apartment, so we felt like the building wasn't really as hasty as it could have been because it was literally only our apartment and there was some trip with the breakers and whatever. Long story short, you know, I let my husband, not even let, I love my husband to handle every single thing. And something needs to be done with this place, and something needs to be done with our car, and something needs to be carried to the car, and something needs to be fixed. I have my husband do that. And here's the reason why. It's not because I can't. I had a car before he knew how to drive. I know how to take care of a car, but I don't want to set up the precedent in our marriage that anytime something goes wrong, the people want to talk to me. I'm not the husband, talk to him. When we have kids, I'm not the dad, talk to him. When we go up to that open school night, you will be talking to me. I'm gonna be carrying my bag and looking cute. And if I have a question, I will ask it. But for me, again, for me, as a black woman who came from having to be on top of things and still in my business in some ways, when I'm in this role, have to be, I don't want to bring that home. I don't want people to feel like they gotta go through me to make sure something is okay with you. The devil is a liar. I don't want to feel like if I don't do this, it won't get done. You know, I know a lot of wives are struck, you know, who I speak to get stressed out because it's like, oh well, my husband said he was gonna do it, but it took so long to do it that I did it. Never. You know that whatever you say you're gonna do, it will sit undone until you do it. Not out of pettiness, out of respect. Yeah. The man said he was gonna do it. Now, if I need to remind you, which is rare, you're very good at this. You actually really do the things you say you're gonna do for the most part. But if I need to remind you or say, hey, babe, the car, you know, said the little thing or say any maintenance or whatever I think I need to remind you of, I remind you gently, it's not an issue. I'm not mad at you about it, because I know that you take care of business. You know what I mean? And so there's a grace that's like, oh, he probably forgot, or he got like, but for me to do it, to me, would communicate to you that I don't think you're capable of keeping your word. I'm not doing it.

SPEAKER_00 50:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 50:56

Period.

SPEAKER_00 50:57

Yeah. And I think the important thing of the glue there is that it goes both ways. It's bi-directional. Correct. Where it's like you, you have to come on bidirectional. Okay.

unknown 51:06

I never heard that word.

SPEAKER_05 51:09

It goes both ways bi directional.

SPEAKER_00 51:11

I'm done. Um, but it's it's just so important to have that established sort of I wouldn't even call it a set of rules, but just like it's dynamic. Dynamic. Yeah. Because one, it it allows things to run smoothly.

SPEAKER_09 51:25

Correct.

Roles Respect And Expectations

SPEAKER_00 51:26

It allows things to run without a conversation. Yes. You know, it is this sort of sense of understanding, almost like a constitution under our marriage, or just like, this is just this is just how we roll, how we do things, and that level of understanding lets things happen much more quickly. Like something that you always joke about is like, you never order paper towels for this house. Never because I don't even know. I put anything on us.

SPEAKER_04 51:47

Paper towels, toilet tissue. I don't do none of that. He does, he got it, he got it. Now, there's some other things he doesn't never do either. Like, honestly, he took me once a year on my birthday, literally. This morning he made me breakfast. Once a year. I got that little show. Yeah, he wasn't for a week. Yeah, it's my birthday week. Um but yeah, we just have very defined roles.

SPEAKER_00 52:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 52:07

And it works for us.

SPEAKER_00 52:08

And it's not even like some like, like you said, like not a trad wife, not like a gender role thing, but just like these are the roles of our marriage. This is what makes our marriage work. Yeah. And I think us one defining that and sticking to it has paid dividends in huge ways because again, it it allows things to naturally fall in their place and allows people to own things. Like we, I don't think we talked about this last time, but in general, we talk about like responsibility and accountability. Yeah. And it's just like knowing who's accountable for something, even if they're not the person who physically goes and do it, they're the person who has to answer for it.

SPEAKER_09 52:44

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 52:44

And I think having that established, it it just clears up so much. It clears up so much. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 52:50

We don't always tell people that we don't have a lot to argue about because we say how things are gonna work, and when things come up, they work that way. So much so that even goes into the mood. We always said before we even got married in our premarital counseling, we said we will always do what is best for his career. And I know some of the feminists are gonna think I'm crazy, but I'm gonna be very clear why I said that. Women, we are very, we can adjust very well. We can put a smile on our face while we're sick, while we're bleeding for seven for seven days a month. We can make new friends. When a in my experience, when a man does not feel secure in his income, his whole personality changes, whole character, his confidence, all the things. So for me, one, he's the actual breadwinner and has the more solid career. I'm an entertainment which could change everything. I tell I say I could either make us a billion billionaires or I can make us broke. Either way, he's gonna keep us upper middle class, okay? All right. So we said we will always do what is best for his career. So when it came up that what was best for his career was for us to bring our narrow black tails back to the Northeast, that's what we did. It wasn't an argument, it was barely a discussion. We were sad, we were both sad. But we did it. And I think having, we have certain parameters around our finances, we have certain parameters around what we will and will not do for others, for family, for friends. And so it doesn't really leave a whole lot of room for arguing because we just have dying, we have a dynamic that works for us. And I think going back to the whole thing about like when you say you're gonna do something, me not doing it, beyond showing you respect, it shows you expectation. I expect you to do the things you say you're gonna do, even if you said them in premarital counseling. I expect that. Yeah, I expect for now, let me be very clear. If there ever comes a day where you're not showing up, I'm not just gonna let our life fall of shambles because you're supposed to be the one that pays the bill. That's silly. But at the end of the day, it's important from for you to know she's counting on me. Yeah, she's counting on me. I don't take the garbage out. She's counting on me. If I don't make sure the car is, she's counting on me. You know what I mean? And what I'm grateful for for you as a man is that you want to be counted on. Not not every man wants to be counted on. Hello, somebody. A lot of men want to count on you because they was counting on their mama and their aunties. And don't I'm serious. I mean, this is no shade, but I see it every day.

SPEAKER_08 55:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 55:20

So I'm always grateful that you are a man who wants to be counted on. You want me to trust you with the difficult things of our lives, and you want me to handle the parts of our lives that are either, you know, a nuisance to you or like like cooking. He does not, and he's a great cook, by the way. I'm like, yo, you be holding out on me, bro.

SPEAKER_00 55:40

Like I just don't enjoy it.

SPEAKER_04 55:42

I know, I know. I happen to really enjoy it. So that works. Now we have spoken about when we become parents, that's gonna have to even out. It's gonna have to get 70-30, you know. Right now it's 99.

SPEAKER_08 55:52

9020.

SPEAKER_04 55:53

Okay, I'm gonna do 80-20. Listen, if I'm a stay-at-home mom, I can do 90 10. Okay, if we keep this going, I can do, you know, but no, but seriously, um, you know, I think that that there is a dynamic here that just really works for us, and I appreciate how you show up. Um, I'm always gonna honor you privately and publicly for the fact that you said to me, I love what I do for a living. And I'm never gonna have you get up and go somewhere you hate every day if I don't get up and go somewhere that I hate every day. When I tell you, let me behave. You know how that went. That is the manliest thing. That's the manliest thing that any man has ever manly man said. Because in that moment I realized, oh my gosh, this man regards my joy and my happiness the way he does his own, if not even more. And I don't know what gave you the trust in me to be able to say, I'm gonna invest in your dreams. I'm gonna make sure that you he literally will say to me, I want you to get up every day and do what you love. I want you to get up every day and have the exact day you want to have. I don't I don't know what I did to deserve that type of trust, but you know this, but I I want to say this. I am going to do everything in my earthly power to make sure that you never regret the way that you have provided for and supported me in this vision. I am going to do everything as long as there's breath in my body to prove to you that you married the right girl. And I I want you to know that.

SPEAKER_00 57:46

I know that. I know that. Thank you for saying that. Thank you for reaffirming it, but I do know that. And I like for me, I I have really truly eternalized that we have one shared destiny.

SPEAKER_10 58:00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 58:00

Like you being happy is my happiness. Your joy is my joy, your sorrow is my sorrow. So for me, it doesn't, it's not a sacrifice. One, I I do love what I do. Yeah, like I wouldn't be doing something different if we weren't together. Right. So who am I to be like, oh no, I'm I'm doing this, so you gotta do like that's silly to me. Yeah. So it's like, no, like if we can have our lives arranged in a certain way where we both can be doing what we love to do and still live a good life. Like, for me, it's it's almost like a no-brainer. It's like, yes, like let's pursue this. One, because, and we discussed this when you know, when while we were moving, like this is there's this is a time capsule, you know. Kids will change this, you know, opportunities will change this, but like we have the opportunity right now to perhaps do something we'll never get a chance to do again. So, like, let's really do it and let's do it all the way. Yeah, and I appreciate you for taking that on because that is that's pressure, if I'm being honest. Like, that's a lot of pressure. I just have to wake up and get on a train and do the same job I've been doing for the past five years. Like, you're figuring it out every single day. Slaunching list.

SPEAKER_10 59:16

Tune in.

SPEAKER_00 59:17

Uh, and I respect that a lot. I respect it a lot, and I believe in you. I have seen your talents up close and personal. It is my goal in life to make sure other people see those talents. Like, I have there is not a thought in my mind that you don't have what it takes. We just have to get the marketing, we just have to get other people to see it. Like, I believe in you so deeply. Yeah, and for me, I feel it's almost like when someone's like an angel investor, they're not doing that. I mean, I'm doing this out of the kindness of my heart, but they're not doing that out of the kindness of their heart, they're doing that because they know I'm gonna get a 10x on this investment. I'm gonna get a 10x on this investment. Like, I truly believe that you are going to take off. Yeah. And I'm just happy that I get the first seat.

SPEAKER_04 1:00:00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:00

I you know.

SPEAKER_04 1:00:01

Yeah. I like my seat too.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:06

I can't with you. You gotta cut that.

SPEAKER_04 1:00:10

Um, no, but uh, I just appreciate you so much. And um having this big life change could have changed that. You could have easily been like, I love you, girl, and this podcast thing is cute, but we move it somewhere that's more expensive. You know, I'm gonna have to be commuting. That's the money that we weren't spending. Like, you gotta figure something out. And you actually went the opposite way and said, and a lot of that's because the way we stewarded, as you mentioned earlier, you know, we did steward our money very well when we lived in Atlanta, and we are continuing to do that here. Um, so it did give us some leverage, it gave us some flexibility, but you've never just pushed me, you've never made me feel, you know, you my husband does not come from an entertainment entrepreneurial. He comes from get a degree, go to work, go to work, get a degree, get another degree, go back to work.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:00

You're giving me the bug a little bit.

SPEAKER_04 1:01:02

If you really need to do something, uh, you know, get another degree.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:05

You know, get a get a promotion.

SPEAKER_04 1:01:07

Uh, he doesn't come from that. So for you to trust me with that has has meant the world. And um, there are times when I feel like I'm slacking, you know, I'm learning the difference between being stagnant and being still. Shout out to my little brother. I had a talk with him and my sister-in-law, um, Jackie, the other day, and they really encouraged me because I said, I just feel stagnant. And they were like, I think the father has you a little still right now. I wouldn't call it stagnant. Like, look at all the stuff that you're doing. And um, that really moved me.

SPEAKER_07 1:01:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:01:38

But I I I feel I do feel that pressure sometime because I want to retire you, you know, one day. I think I have a little insecurity around, I was not raised with like you don't work. It's like, get a job, girl. Again, I mean, and my husband always says, you have a job. It's called Blame Media. And I'll just let myself in podcast and your YouTube channel and your Instagram and the brand you want to work. Like, that's your job. Um, but I think sometimes I can feel a little weird about that. And I just appreciate you always making sure that I understand that what I'm doing is just as important to you as what you do. What I contribute to our family is just important to you as what I contribute. And it's humbling for me, you know. It is humbling. I definitely do feel a pressure, self-imposed pressure most of the time, because I just want you to know that I'm not chilling up in here eating bonbons, you know. I am trying to make this thing work because I do want you to wake up one day and say, Oh my gosh, she she really did it. Like I knew she could do it, but she really did it. You know, and um we really did it. And I and I want you to to have that feeling one day.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:47

Me too. I can't wait.

Building A Business As Spouses

SPEAKER_04 1:02:48

Yeah, it's coming. It's coming. So speaking of that, I got two more questions. One is, how is it working and building a business? Okay, working and building a business with your spouse, how is that? And uh, what advice would you give someone who is starting a business or has a business with their wife or husband?

SPEAKER_00 1:03:11

It's interesting. It's interesting. It is there is always this like fine line that you have to walk where it's like, am I encouraging husband today or am I your like investor? Like, or it's just like, you know, um, and like it's it's I think our dynamic is different because a lot of a lot of husband and wife businesses, they're both like they're both doing the thing together. Right. Like they would have a piece of it. No, they take it out a bank loan or something and whatnot. It's just like I I'm using my nine to fives to fund what we're doing here. Yeah. So, and I think that makes it that has this pros and cons. Correct. Where one, it's like we don't have a bank to answer to, so we're not like we're not you know building up debt and all this stuff, but it's like we are we've made a conscious decision where it's like, hey, there are some things that we want to do in our life with this money, they're like, no, we're gonna use it to invest here. And I'm sure that again adds to your pressure of just like, all right, the return, the return is real now, you know. The return has to has to be monetary, it can't just be like views or it can't just be status, it has to, it has to bring back what we've put into it as a family. But I think working together, I think is a blessing. Yeah. You know, I think it it it lets us discover a part of our relationship that I don't think I don't know if we would have. Maybe in parenthood we would have seen glimpses of it. Um, but it it's sort of this this preview of what it's gonna take to one really build something from scratch, to have difficult but loving conversations about things, to tough things out, yeah, to you know, to grow in big ways, to expose weaknesses, take losses, to take losses, to confront things, you know, things that we don't like about ourselves, things that we want the other person to do better. Yeah, you know, it's it's there's just there's just so much in starting a business. Yes. Um it's not something that I would recommend for any everyone. I'll be I'll be totally honest.

SPEAKER_04 1:05:21

I would agree. It's not something that I would feel like we don't even have a whole lot of drama.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:25

We don't, but it's just we don't, but it's it's a sh it's an added strain to a relationship. Like it's just like in the same way that having a kid, yep. It's an added strain and controversial. Not everyone should have, you know, in the same vein, not everyone should go into business with their significant other. Like it is something that you actually have to count the costs on. Yeah. Um, because it can it can go either way.

SPEAKER_04 1:05:47

Yeah. I think for me, I I would advise, and you can fall on either when uh Kevon Stage says it like this he calls himself the kite and Melissa the string. And And without the kite, the string is just useless. But without the string, the kite is gonna fall, it's not, it's not really going anywhere. And I think in business, he said it much better than I did. So if you haven't seen the episode with Kev on Stage, go back and watch the episode with Kevin on Stage. But I think about our relationship and how there has to be a trust to be guided. But the as a string, you also have to really love what the kite does. It has to be fascinating to you. Or else, why am I even here?

SPEAKER_00 1:06:31

Yeah, I can promise you. If you was out here selling perfumes, wrap it up. Wrap it up.

SPEAKER_06 1:06:39

There's something about he's dead serious. So it could be anything.

SPEAKER_04 1:06:44

You sure it's perfumes, he's not trying to hear it. Um but yeah, I think there's a part of you that is fascinated with what I do. I think that the only reason I would not recommend it for some is it takes an intense level of trust. And some of the reasons that we trust each other predate us. I'll give you an example. My trust and my husband's ability to take care of me financially comes from the way he was taking care of himself and his sister. Another conversation for another grown adult. She's great. I love her. She's also I'm not gonna take that part out because I love my sister in law. Um, but um financially, the way you were with your friends, the way you guarded your own, you know, finances, that predates me.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:07:37

His trust in my ability to execute when it comes to entertainment predates him.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:07:42

He saw me work on music and he didn't know he didn't, we we met on a blind date. So he had to go.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:47

But we met because correct of your music.

SPEAKER_04 1:07:49

I was here, I was in New York. Well, yeah, yeah. I was in New York doing a gig and we had a blind date, and I had put out an album that week. So he saw me doing press. He saw me, you know, working at the time with Kevin Lyles and 300 Entertainment. He saw me doing different things. And then he went back and saw all the things that I had done prior to that. And so there's a trust that we have in each other's ability to execute in the area we're supposed to execute that is needed if you're gonna go into business with someone. And then I think we are also really respectful of each other's strengths. Like if there is something I think is really, really important, um, whether it be visually, aesthetically, I think we need it, I think we need to go to this event. I think I need to be here for my career. I think I need to pay for a studio to interview this certain person. He's like, great, we got it, go ahead and do it. If he really thinks, babe, this is not a good way to spend our money. There's not a whole lot of return. Like you said, we can't be doing stuff for clout and status. So yeah, you go to this red carpet, but what do we actually get from that? I think we should skip out on this one. We skip out on it. It's not a big deal. No one is butthurt and acting weird with each other. It's like, all right, we we see the value in this, we see the value in that. And it causes us, like you said, to have those difficult talks. Because one of those things that we had to talk about early on was okay, what is worth the investment?

SPEAKER_02 1:09:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:09:11

We can't be paying for a studio for every single person just because they don't want to come to New Jersey. Some people we just have to, they're either gonna have to come here to our house or we're just not gonna interview.

SPEAKER_00 1:09:19

I mean, before that, we had to decide the first eight episodes of this we paid to have recorded and and produced. And, you know, shout out. Like, we we love that production. We love what got us off the ground, but we had to make a determination like, hey, if this is going to be evergreen, this is not a cost that we can bear. Correct, you know, and what is it going to take for us to get to a place where we can do this?

SPEAKER_04 1:09:40

And that took me trusting him because I was vehemently against that. I was like, what? Like, first of all, you're asking me to fire my friends, number one. I like these people, I love these people. Shout out to Fortune.

SPEAKER_00 1:09:52

I'm like, fire scroll.

SPEAKER_04 1:09:54

Yeah, it wasn't fire because we actually need to work with another stuff. But you're asking me to tell them, oh, we're no longer gonna need your services in the same capacity because we're gonna start doing it. Um, then it's like, and we also need to ask y'all to teach us how to do it, by the way. By the way, we ain't gonna pay you how to do it no more. But what the fuck can you teach us what to do? I was very uncomfortable with that. They didn't have to be. We're really friends, and that's the thing. Like, we're family, you know what I mean? Like, they could come stay on our couch if they needed to. We don't feel that way about a lot of people, you know. So, and they helped us and they taught us and they taught us what to buy and all the things. And even when I wanted to buy my first camera, you were not that gung-ho about that at first. You was like, why didn't we need a camera? Like, we just getting started. But then when we decided to take the podcast home, we only had to buy one more camera because we already had the first camera. So the trust with each other and like the respect for each other's opinion on things, and that even goes to like our home and what we wear and the places we go and where we go to church. We really talk about everything and try to really respect one another's opinion. I could talk to you all night, obviously, and I shall after this because I I literally told him one day, I was like, I don't know how you live with me, talk to me, watch the podcast, like you just listen to me, yap, all the time. God bless you. How do you do it? Because I'd be tired of hearing myself talk.

SPEAKER_00 1:11:09

Because God has blessed me. I love it. I love it. You know, you ever see those beans where like, oh, he's exactly where he wants to be. That's me. That is you.

SPEAKER_04 1:11:20

That is you, that is you. Um, I'm gonna ask you this, but I'm gonna share first. I said I had two questions. That's a lie.

SPEAKER_08 1:11:26

I have three.

Tiny Habits That Keep Joy

SPEAKER_04 1:11:27

What is your favorite thing that I do, like in our life and in our house? I'm gonna go first. My favorite thing, and this is not what you think, is how you like to dance in the kitchen when certain things come on. Like if I play, you're just too good to be true. Like, he's gonna come and grab me and we're gonna just dance in the kitchen. And then we might go back to doing what we were doing before. We might just dance for another two or three songs and talk and hang out and see wherever that leads. But it is just something that I I think I grew up wanting that kind of like romantic dance with me, baby, kind of thing.

SPEAKER_08 1:12:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:12:08

But I didn't grow up around men like that. At least not from why maybe they were like that at home, but they didn't. So I just didn't, I just didn't think I would ever have that. So when you do stuff like that, or when you just bring me flowers randomly, or like when we're like hearty, har har belly laughing about something with the like that the other person didn't. Um, that's my favorite. You bring a lot of joy to our house. Yeah like when you walk through the door at 558, I know exactly what time you come in. I'm just like, oh, my man is home. Um, and I feel just so much warmth in love. But yeah, that's my favorite thing. The dancing, the dancing in the kitchen. I love that.

SPEAKER_00 1:12:47

I love that. Mine is like almost the opposite. Mine is when when you like do something goofy that like I started. And it's just like, what it's just like it's very, it's just very endearing, but also like you're such a cool person naturally. And I'm like, oh, she's like brought herself down to my like the true goofball level. Just just it. If you if there were hitting cameras, oh my gosh, y'all would be like, what is wrong with me? We make noises, we do little dance gooses, we just very, very much on the spectrum. Yes, the two of us. Big time. And I just love it. And just like one, it it makes me feel seen because I'm like, I can be this goofball, and and one, it's not weird for her. Two, she has started doing it herself, and now I'm like, oh, I see you even more now. Or it's just like, yeah, you feel comfortable enough to just be completely just unabashedly goofy around me. And it's just like, yeah, this is love.

SPEAKER_06 1:13:49

That's so embarrassing, but it's so true.

SPEAKER_04 1:13:51

I know for the first time, I'm not gonna say what I did, but like that little voice thing that we do, I was like, oh my god, did I just do that?

SPEAKER_06 1:14:01

And he lost it. Like he was like, It was the funniest thing.

SPEAKER_04 1:14:05

Um but no, I I I that's good. I didn't expect that answer, but that's gonna say something about me cooking or something. Um, but no, I love that. That's good. Um, with all that we've talked about, all the changes, you know, like I said, this time last year, Kim was alive. You know, I think she was just starting to get sick in March, the end of March, because we had a women's history, I mean a women's service that I preached at, and she was there. Yeah, so I think she was well at this time last year. Moving back to New York wasn't even on the table. We were talking about buying a house. We were talking about buying a house, having Christmas at our house, and hopefully announcing to our family that we were pregnant. We had a plan. That's what God be like now. Did y'all really think we really thought that that's what I was talking about? Yeah, we're saying that God's face. Yeah, we was like, I'm gonna buy the house and like late October, November, get it just ready enough for Christmas, then we'll hopefully be pregnant and we can announce it at Christmas and our house will be the holiday house and all the stuff. So we that there are people who were in our lives, friends, who we are no longer, you know, that who are no longer around us in that same capacity, whether it be circumstantial or just distance. Um and so with all that, right, with all those changes, what do you feel like you are ready for now that you were not ready for this time last year?

SPEAKER_00 1:15:24

I feel like I keep coming back to this, but I'm I'm just I feel like I'm ready for the storms. I feel like there was a part of it, it's it's one of those things where it's like I rebuke that, but go ahead. Yes, not not not necessarily the storms, but we're not calling them, but we're ready for the storm. But it's like that that Mike Tyson quote where it's like everyone has a plan to get punched in the face.

SPEAKER_05 1:15:44

Yeah.

Feeling Ready For Motherhood

SPEAKER_00 1:15:44

We got punched in the face and we won the fight.

SPEAKER_05 1:15:46

Correct.

SPEAKER_00 1:15:47

Like, and I feel like that's just so important.

SPEAKER_05 1:15:49

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:15:49

Because it it is very different when the thing is happening.

SPEAKER_10 1:15:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:15:54

And there is a certain level of knowing when you're on the other side. And I feel the same, like, I I it's not as dramatic, but I feel this a lot of the same things after the passing of my parents, where it's like, this was so hard, but being on the other side has brought a level of strength and confidence, and you've seen it and the way that I've tackled things since we've met, whereas like, and I've told you, I'm just like, I've been through the worst thing. Yeah, like this is what is this? Definitely say that. And and I feel like obviously there are gonna be, you know, the Lord protect us, but there are gonna be other big things in our marriage. But like this was one of those where it's like, oh yeah, like we've we've dealt with absolute chaos, yeah, and we love each other even more out of it.

SPEAKER_10 1:16:42

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 1:16:42

So I I just I don't know, it gives me a sense of strength and and knowing, which is so strong, like a knowing that like this is my partner. Like, I don't I don't know what to tell you, like this is my person. Like, and I I just I I it makes me feel ready for so much.

SPEAKER_04 1:16:57

Yeah, absolutely. I think for me, with all that has happened and transpired, what I'm ready for that I certainly was not ready for this time last year, is motherhood. I think as much of a game as I was talking about, oh, I want to be pregnant by the end of the year and whatever, whatever, the character growth that I have experienced in this last couple of months, I think is gonna be paramount to the type of mom I will become if God will have that.

SPEAKER_00 1:17:27

Can you expand on that?

SPEAKER_04 1:17:28

Yeah, I think that I have learned to be uncomfortable. And motherhood is very uncomfortable. Yeah. From what I can see. No shade to any of my friends with kids. I actually appreciate y'all for keeping it real with me. Motherhood is a lot of self-denial, it's a lot of doing things you don't feel like doing when you don't feel like doing them. It's a lot of not doing things you want to do because you're not in a life stage to do that. And although this move wasn't that extreme of a transition as I'm sure motherhood will be, it just showed me like, oh, you have what it takes. You have what it takes for God to say no and you can still show up happy. You have what it takes to lose something that means a lot to you and still be loving and kind and joyful and still provide a happy home. And you have what it takes to move somewhere completely different and make that into a home, just like you made the last place into a home. And I think that these were things that I needed to know about myself. And then I also think that, again, I don't know if God is gonna allow us to have children or not. I truly believe He will. But there is a part of me that just knows that I'm really that girl.

SPEAKER_02 1:18:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:18:29

Like, I don't think I knew that for real before this. Like, oh yeah, I'm really a great wife.

SPEAKER_07 1:18:35

Yeah.

The Legacy We Want

SPEAKER_04 1:18:35

I'm really like moving back and being closer to the friends that I've known my whole life, people I grew up with, people who I've been friends with for 20 plus years, and being around them is be like, oh yeah, I'm really an incredible friend. You know, being probably closer to my sister and my mom now than I was, talking to them more because ministry was taking me out. So talking to them more now, I'm like, wow, I'm really that relationship is solidified, you know. And um yeah, I think just some of the trials that I've gone through in the last couple of months, losing someone very close to me, you know, and and navigating relational things has really shown me, like, yeah, you you you're really that girl. You can really do this. And you've always told me that since we met. You're like, I don't know what you're talking about. But I think there was some sense of insecurity and worthiness issues that I have that I just no longer really have. There are traces, but generally I'm like, I'm ready to go. I'm good. And so I'm excited. I think I'm also ready for just depth in our relationship. I think there were things that I was always like, oh, he's gonna leave me one day because I'm too this or I'm too that or I'm not enough this or not enough that. And I feel like through this move and um just how well you have taken care of me in this space and this time has let me know, like, oh yeah, he's locked in. I don't need to be insecure. My you know, my cousin Kenya, she has an incredible influence on me, you know, this. And we were talking, we were on our way to the brandy concert. And you had done something, like something really sweet. You said something really sweet to me, or something, I can't remember what it was. And um, I told her, I said, sometime I just really like I just can't believe that this is my husband, and like it feels like surreal. And and she told me, she was like, one day it'll just it'll just click. You will settle into like this is real, the other shoe is not gonna drop. He loves me, he's not going anywhere. And she told me when that happened for her with her husband, Craig. And I feel like this move moved that along for me. Yeah, you know, I'm like, oh, he's really here. Like he's not going anywhere, there's no conditions on this. He loves me, he likes me as a person, you know. Um, he wants to build his life with me, and it's giving me such a sense of calm. And I feel like that's the real soft life, right? It is great. I love everything you do for me. I love the trips and the mall runs and all the stuff, and it's great, and I appreciate it. But the real soft life is a calm the nervous system by understanding that we are locked in, understanding that if we have a disagreement, there's not gonna be any yelling or disrespect or walking out or storming off. Understanding that there's a level of desire on your end to always help me appear in the best light, that you're never gonna embarrass me, say nothing crazy about me, have me looking crazy, and vice versa. And um, I just appreciate that about our marriage. It it I I I wake up every day with no concern about our marriage, and I pray that it stays that way. And I really pray that it stays that way. Well, you know how we end the podcast. We ask a question here in the grand scheme of things. What do you want your legacy to be? And we've asked this question before in the last episode, so we're gonna do it these episodes in the grand scheme of things, and I'm only gonna have you answer.

SPEAKER_00 1:21:46

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 1:21:46

What do you want the legacy of our marriage to be?

SPEAKER_00 1:21:50

I want the legacy of our marriage to be one of joy. Joy in the face of anything. Like it we just meet every situation with smiles, with with jolly, like I'm a naturally jolly person. I feel like I'm starting to rub off I was I was not.

SPEAKER_04 1:22:11

You are starting to rub off on me.

SPEAKER_00 1:22:13

But when you bring joy to a situation, it it lightens so much, it it really opens, sort of opens the the veins to to absorb just a lot more possibility. And I want us to be that for each other. I want us to be that for people around us, friends, family, the people who watch this podcast. I I just think that when we can bring joy to these situations, it's a real unlock.

SPEAKER_04 1:22:45

Well, it is easy to bring joy to situations with that dimple right there. And then your naturally jolly disposition and your desire to stay calm in the face of difficult situations. I always tell people, I look crazy acting the way I used to act in front of you. I'd be embarrassed to fly off the handle and get annoyed and frustrated the way that I used to act when I was single before you. Um, I would be embarrassed to be that way in front of you because your character and your integrity and the way you carry yourself just calls me higher. I had worked on that for a little bit before I met you, but still, I think a different person. I might have still been acting like that. And I just appreciate your desire to keep that energy in our lives. And so I think we're well on our way to building that legacy. And um, I'm excited to see what God does in our relationship in the future.

SPEAKER_00 1:23:31

Me too.

SPEAKER_04 1:23:32

Thank you for being here, baby.

SPEAKER_00 1:23:33

Yes, number three.

SPEAKER_04 1:23:34

Number three into love. Into love. We get it in. Well, thank you so much for watching another episode of my podcast. I'll just let myself in. The podcast where we don't wait for an imaginary permission slip or a seat at some imaginary table. We let ourselves in. And I want to give you a call to let yourself into love. You might be watching this episode and you might be like, man, that's great for them, but I don't know if I'm gonna find that, or the last person hurt me, or whatever. And you might be holding your heart away from the love that God wants to give you. He wants to give you love from him, but he also wants to give you love from community. He wants you in a relationship with others, and he may even want you in a romantic relationship with the spouse. So let us be an encouragement to you that anything can happen. I met my husband when I was 33 and we got married at 35, and we have been living an incredible life for the past two and a half years. And so if it can happen for me, it can certainly happen for you. If you've listened to this episode on Holy Culture, channel 140 on SiriusXM Monday nights, 8 p.m. Eastern Standard Time, we thank you so much for listening there. If you've watched on their YouTube, we thank you for watching there. And if you've watched on my YouTube channel, thank you for watching there. Be sure to subscribe and hit the notification bell so that you do not miss any of my upcoming episodes or content. And we'll be back here, same time, same place next week. See you then. Peace.